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Thread: 400m training

  1. #71

    Re: 400m training

    Quote Originally Posted by pindaman View Post
    there are basically only 2 real hard days. the second day (after a hard day)was more about what you can handle. so if you feel pain/tired. then you run less fast. By doing so you keep injuries away.
    the 2nd day its better to do less than too much.
    the week shown is a sample for week 1 gpp. gpp is 6 weeks so i chanched workouts evey week with keeping the basic plan a starting point for my own plan.
    you have 2 very easy days that are for recovery - easy tempo/pool work and may be massage/fysio if you can spare the time/money.
    Thanks. did you train any plyos?
    I cant quite understand how you only have 2 hard days when fridays are intensive tempo. If you are trying to hit some fast paces, at least for me it seems that mondays and thusdays will be hard and same with thursday and friday.
    Did you train kitkats cutdows weekly?
    What did you do in the transition period?
    Sorry for all the questions I am just trying to understand more.

  2. #72

    Re: 400m training

    Quote Originally Posted by volle View Post
    Thanks. did you train any plyos?
    I cant quite understand how you only have 2 hard days when fridays are intensive tempo. If you are trying to hit some fast paces, at least for me it seems that mondays and thusdays will be hard and same with thursday and friday.
    Did you train kitkats cutdows weekly?
    What did you do in the transition period?
    Sorry for all the questions I am just trying to understand more.
    monday and thirsday are most important. so that are the key days.
    tuesday is less fast than monday, but will be quite fast.
    friday will be hard to do fast. So you do that day as you feel so target may be hard , but if you feel sluggish after hard monday, thuesday and thirsday you go slower on friday. It is not a problem. Keep in mind these plans are made for wold class athletes with more talent and recovery options like massage than many of us.eg the likes of me, so i have to get due to what my body lets me do. I sometimes did the intensive tempo on saterday instead of friday.

    Again do not be afraid you might do too little work.

  3. #73

    Re: 400m training

    Quote Originally Posted by DMA View Post
    Ollie as we are moving into the early start of our season, season locally is 6 months, and daylight savings starts as well. The weekly sessions will be something like this

    Day 1 - Speed
    Day 2 - Endurance (generally extensive tempo)
    Day 3 - Off
    Day 4 - Speed or Special Endurance
    Day 5 - easy Endurance (easier than the Day 2)
    Day 6 - Special or Speed Endurance - depends on what local races are on
    Day 7 - Off

    I will use some of the local races as special endurance sessions, I am still working out these at the moment.

    Is Day 4 Speed or Special Endurance or do you mean Speed Endurance or Special Endurance?

    I've gone back to read Key Concepts and Charlie talked about spreading out the work in terms of high intensity days. So in this case Day 1 is the hardest followed by Day 6 and then Day 4. Have you played around with this at all?

    I would have two days of tempo as well. Do you feel any need to ensure the volume is at a certain level with only two days? I imagine three days allows for a greater weekly volume but cuts into recovery.

  4. #74
    Member DMA's Avatar
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    Re: 400m training

    Speed or Special Endurance means speed endurance or special endurance

    Last year I played around with the weekly schedule as above, and although not ideal - it seemed to work okay. Having it is a spd end or spec end session, allows me to be more flexible.
    Continuing to learn is one thing in life that has to continue.

  5. #75

    Re: 400m training

    Quote Originally Posted by pindaman View Post
    monday and thirsday are most important. so that are the key days.
    tuesday is less fast than monday, but will be quite fast.
    friday will be hard to do fast. So you do that day as you feel so target may be hard , but if you feel sluggish after hard monday, thuesday and thirsday you go slower on friday. It is not a problem. Keep in mind these plans are made for wold class athletes with more talent and recovery options like massage than many of us.eg the likes of me, so i have to get due to what my body lets me do. I sometimes did the intensive tempo on saterday instead of friday.

    Again do not be afraid you might do too little work.
    Thanks. I am very willing to try this kind of training. But its counterintuitive I think. Thats is possible to increase speed while not really training any top speed at all.
    Can I ask what your previuos pbs were before you trained kitkats program?
    From what I have read to drop the 400m pb, the 200m pb also need to be dropped. And I cant see how I as a slower person (24.2 200m pb) can increase my speed with this type of training you are doing.
    I tought I needed 2-3 short speed sessions every week. 30-60m full speed long rec.

  6. #76

    Re: 400m training

    Quote Originally Posted by volle View Post
    Thanks. I am very willing to try this kind of training. But its counterintuitive I think. Thats is possible to increase speed while not really training any top speed at all.
    Can I ask what your previuos pbs were before you trained kitkats program?
    From what I have read to drop the 400m pb, the 200m pb also need to be dropped. And I cant see how I as a slower person (24.2 200m pb) can increase my speed with this type of training you are doing.
    I tought I needed 2-3 short speed sessions every week. 30-60m full speed long rec.

    I have to say thanks for all the advices and recommendations and I realize that I need to READ and LEARN more myself now.
    I have got many suggestions on what to read now and I will do that before asking more questions!

  7. #77

    Re: 400m training

    Hey Volle! Thats the best thing you can do. I also recomend you getting in some basic speed planning and development information (vancouver or edmont). I think your idea of building speed starting with 60m right out in GPP its just begging for a plateu xD

  8. #78
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    Re: 400m training

    Quote Originally Posted by ESTI
    To break 50 seconds, being able to run 22.7 or faster will likely need to be achieved. In my first year with this progression, a kid opened running 23.7 and 51.3, and ended running 22.3 9 weeks later. He ran 50.x and even a 48.9x the last 3-4 weeks fairly consistently. This was with only 9 weeks of preparation and 2 meets a week (usually 1-2x200, 1-2x400).
    Volle, In about 2 months, I had a kid accomplish what you are aiming for. a 1.4 second drop in 200m shows with a 5-6 week gpp, and a 4 week transition phase, you can reach levels you wish to achieve. It's very possible to do and I did it in a short time. T Slow took his guy from 48 seconds to sub 47 in 13 weeks and saw over 0.5 improvement in his 200m in that season.

  9. #79

    Re: 400m training

    Quote Originally Posted by ESTI View Post
    Volle, In about 2 months, I had a kid accomplish what you are aiming for. a 1.4 second drop in 200m shows with a 5-6 week gpp, and a 4 week transition phase, you can reach levels you wish to achieve. It's very possible to do and I did it in a short time. T Slow took his guy from 48 seconds to sub 47 in 13 weeks and saw over 0.5 improvement in his 200m in that season.
    Thanks that sounds promising.
    I will follow kitkats program. Only change I will do is to lower the volume abit.
    Is there a sample week from kitkats training in the competition period? I can only remember seeing GPP and transition period.

  10. #80
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    Re: 400m training

    As advised previously, read the Lactate Ebook, ESTI's journal, and my journals. It's all there. The reason I am repeating myself is if you actually sit down and take the time to read these resources, they will give you:

    1) The theoretical framework and program laid out for a 400m elite athlete (Lactate Ebook)
    2) An adapted KitKat program for high school athletes (ESTI's journal)
    3) An adapted KitKat program for a masters athlete (T-Slow's journal with notes from ESTI)
    30 An adapted KitKat program for a 400m athlete aspiring to be national class (another T-Slow journal)

    By reading the above, ideally a few times each- you will be able to put together a program for yourself. Sample weeks will be of ZERO use if you don't understand the above, so please stop asking and get to work!
    Last edited by T-Slow; 09-30-2013 at 03:01 PM.

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